Let Me Slip Into Something A Little Less Comfortable

In our world, “sex” means fucking. It means a man inserting his penis into a woman’s vagina until he ejaculates. After the man ejaculates, the sex is finished. Anything that precedes the man putting his penis into the woman’s vagina is referred to as “foreplay” and anything that happens after the man has ejaculated and is no longer physically able to penetrate the woman with his penis, is “afterplay.” So, for women, “having sex” is being vaginally penetrated by a man’s penis. Women are expected to “have sex” – or PIV – throughout most of their lives and aren’t really offered any alternatives. If they want to be in a relationship with a man, that man is going to expect sex and PIV is sex.

It is in this context that girls grow up so… let’s talk about sex.

All women are born into a culture in which heterosexuality is expected and culturally mandated with PIV as a perceived natural inevitability. Girls are groomed for PIV from the second they open their eyes. If you’re born with a vagina you can put money on the fact that, at some point in your life, men are going to try to get you to let them put their penis inside it. This is true whether you’re a Black woman or a white woman, whether you’re rich or poor, whether you’re lesbian or heterosexual, whether you live in the global north or the global south.

If you acquiesce consent to a man’s request to penetrate you with his penis you “had sex” with that man.

If a man requests that you allow him to penetrate you with his penis and you withhold your consent then the law (in most cases) says he should refrain. If the man sees that you are withholding consent but then inserts his penis into your vagina anyway, this becomes a crime which we call rape.

Rape and sex are both PIV. Sex is PIV that a woman has acquiesced consented to and rape is PIV that a woman has actively refused. If a man is accused of rape, he can use the defence of ‘no, this was actually consensual sex,’ or ‘I didn’t see that she didn’t consent. How was I to know not to fuck her if she did not alert me to the fact that she didn’t want to be fucked?

Some radical feminists outright state that all heterosexual intercourse is rape. Some radical feminists disagree and say that statement lacks nuance. A lot of heterosexual feminists say they feel personally insulted by the statement “all intercourse is rape” because they have had personal experience of PIV they wanted and PIV they didn’t want and have processed those experiences as different from each other. I understand that. It makes me uncomfortable too. The whole subject of PIV makes me uncomfortable. I endured it for more than ten years of my life until I discovered radical feminism, read FCM’s Intercourse Series, had my mind blown and quit it. I feel like it’s impossible to get a sense of clarity about PIV and what it does to your psyche until you stop doing it and this is because of the trauma bonding that FCM talks about. Women who are still engaging in heterosexual relationships feel particularly uncomfortable with the suggestion that all intercourse is rape because it means acknowledging firstly that the man you share your bed with is a rapist and secondly, that you possess virtually no social power or bodily autonomy. These are hard things to face.

Another thing that’s hard for women to accept is that we do not own our sexualities. There is not a woman alive today who has an authentic sexuality of her own. All women have been groomed to be penis receptacles in a cultural narrative of man-meets-woman-man-puts-penis-in-woman’s-vagina. We are told we like putting things in our vaginas, especially penises, and that’s about the end of it.

If a girl is lucky enough to receive any sex education, she will be taught the biological basics. She’ll learn that men have penises and testicles and produce sperm and women have vaginas and uterii and produce ova. She’ll learn that when a man and a woman have sex, the man inserts his penis into the woman’s vagina until he ejaculates. She’ll learn that the semen in the ejaculate will render her vulnerable to pregnancy so she will have to protect herself by using a hormonal or a barrier contraceptive. Hormonal contraception is preferable because barrier methods such as condoms, while safer for women, apparently reduce sensation for men which is obviously a no-no. It’s much better that a woman take a pill every day for her entire reproductive lifespan, or get a painful injection every 12 weeks, or have a copper rod inserted into her uterus, or a silicone rod implanted into her arm. She probably won’t learn that 3 out of 4 women never orgasm from vaginal intercourse. She almost definitely won’t learn how women do achieve orgasm. She’ll learn her place as a receptacle.

The American Association of Obstetrics and Gynecology estimates that 3 out of 4 women experience pain during intercourse. For some women the pain is temporary or intermittent and for others it is chronic and long-term. Pain is your body’s way of telling you something is wrong yet when women seek medical assistance for pain during intercourse, they are almost invariably given advice or medication or even surgery that will aid them in continuing to have intercourse. The American Association of Obstetrics and Gynecology advises women who experience burning pain after intercourse to just wrap some ice in a towel and apply it to your vulva. No big deal. You can also take preventative action like a painkiller before bed!

Women are acquiescing consenting to all this shit because they literally do not know any different. Until I discovered radical feminism, it hadn’t even occurred to me that I could refuse.

There’s another way to look at PIV without couching it in the problematic language of consent.

Rape is when a man uses his penis as a weapon against a woman or girl against her will.

Sex is when a man uses his penis as a weapon against a woman or girl with her consent.

PIV can be justified as ‘always rape’ because it always involves the weaponization of the penis against a woman on a girl. The woman may ‘enjoy’ the sensation of having a penis inside her but she wouldn’t be the first woman in the world to eroticize her own subordination as a means of coping with it. Men know that every single time they stick their dicks in a woman, they’re putting her  at risk of pregnancy. They know that pregnancy can kill women. They know that if they cause a pregnancy to occur they can walk away at any time with no major social consequences. They know what kind of harm’s way they’re putting us in but they really like ejaculating inside us so they do it anyway.

The thing with PIV is that, much like BDSM, it doesn’t really matter how much you like it and how free you think your choice is when you make it; the activity in itself is inherently harmful. It’s a form of assault. Whether or not you acquiesce to the assault or ‘want’ the assault doesn’t change the nature of the assault.

It’s not a coincidence that PIV is considered the primary human sex act. Let’s face it – men can achieve orgasm with ease. Whether they’re sticking their dicks in women, children, animals, Land Rovers, ambulances, shoes, couches, vacuum cleaners, bicycles, drinks trollies, or their own balled up fists, men make sure they have orgasms. Yet it’s the act of reproductive mating they’ve chosen as the most desirable despite the risks involved for women. The act that carries the greatest risk for women and offers the smallest reward. The act that puts women in a constant state of reproductive vulnerability.

It isn’t possible to categorically state that all heterosexual intercourse is not rape when what men do to express “love” for women (sex/PIV) is the same as what they do to express contempt for women (rape/PIV).

92 responses

  1. Men know that every single time they stick their dicks in a woman, they’re putting her at risk of pregnancy. They know that pregnancy can kill women. They know that if they cause a pregnancy to occur they can walk away at any time with no major social consequences. They know what kind of harm’s way they’re putting us in but they really like ejaculating inside us so they do it anyway.

    Indeed yes. In a risk-assessment scenario, PIV (for females) gets a huge FAIL.

    Apart from the obvious risk of pregnancy (and its complications, up to and including death for the female, particularly for younger girls), the risk of male-to-female transmission of sexually transmitted diseases is higher than the other way around.

    Then, contraception. It is usually the female taking the precautions (or insisting on precautions like condoms) because she knows that she is the one who bears the risk. Contraception usually has risk. Risk of failure (so pregnancy; the risk of pregnancy or obtaining an abortion) is just one. The hormonal pill is, for many women, not tolerated well at all (many lose their libidos anyway), but the risk of the OCP is DVT or stroke (and possible death). The IUD (or IUCD) also has risks – internal infections (possible death), heavier periods (and possible anemia), and quite frequently, ectopic pregnancies (again risking death). As for condoms, some women are allergic to them (or the spermicides with them).

    So all this risking disease, discomfort and death… for what? So some dude can use you like a masturbatory device?

    And we haven’t really covered all the coercion in the typical ‘het’ relationship – any kind of coercion is RAPE anyway, including sulking to get his way.

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  2. As a woman I understand this. As a heterosexual woman in a sexual relationship taking birth control pills to avoid pregnancy, and being very afraid of pregnancy because it’s something I don’t want, it is indeed frustrating because I can understand this. I have never woken up and been thankful to be female. I wonder how much of that is the messages I’ve been sent about how great being male is, and how much is my true feelings. So it continues to be very frustrating.

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  3. Reblogged this on So Far Away and commented:

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  4. “I want this chick to come over my house on a Sunday morning, wake me up with a kiss on my cheek and then make me pancakes. Really, that’s it. I like her too much to fuck her.”

    Just read that on a gossip site during my random web surfs. The site has a mostly male following and this is what one commenter said about actress Hilary Duff. Telling, isn’t it. He “likes her too much” to put his penis inside of her.

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  5. blackmetalvalkyrie | Reply

    No woman is heterosexual.

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    1. Well, quite. But I didn’t want this to be 8,000 words long. Maybe I’ll go into that another time.

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      1. blackmetalvalkyrie

        Okay. :-)

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      2. As much as I disagree with your post about PIV, I am interested and would like to learn more about extreme feminism.

        The way I see it, your POV on PIV could be extremely helpful for women who have been raped, abused, had issues with their sexual identity / agency, etc. which, to be fair, covers a LOT of women. But for happily committed women in het relationships with men who are hip to equality, I don’t see what is gained by villifying PIV and referring to penises as weapons. Even as a man who is actually pretty interested in your philosophy, it is a bit of a stumbling block to attempt to digest your assertion that every instance of PIV constitutes a man using his penis as a weapon against a woman.

        It’s not that you haven’t made some good points about risk and responsibility, but while many of the misogynistic systems of power were erected by man to exclude and control women, we aren’t responsible for our own biology. Penises just happen to be more STD-resistant than vaginas. Men just happen to be incapable of childbirth. I can’t help having a penis, and I don’t feel like I should have to apologize or feel guilty for using it in a way that my wife and I both enjoy immensely.

        In short, I think you generalize based on your own experience. I think the issue of agency in sexual interactions between men and women cannot be summed up with anything so trite as “dicks are weapons”. It’s a complex issue and looks very different from relationship to relationship. If your partner (male or female) is experiencing discomfort or pain from sexual activity (any kind), stop and talk about it until you can find something that works for both of you. There are so many ways to enjoy one another that (at least for me) it’s not a PIV-or-nothing proposition. If your partner is coersive and continually pressures you to do things you don’t want to do, it’s his or her fault alone. Don’t project the issues of a handful of your exes onto the entirety of my gender, please.

        Also, sometimes when I get massaged, it hurts a bit. Is my masseuse abusive?

        I hope I’ve made a few points that will stay with you and inform your future diatribes. Men can be jerks, but so can women. If you want to change the world with your ideas, you’re gonna need both on your side.

        Thank you for taking the time to read my reply. In spite of my conclusions about it, your article was a fascinating read. I would love to hear more about extreme feminist theory.

        Specifically, why is no woman heterosexual?

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      3. Hi Mike. I don’t actually write for men. I write for women. This article is not an attempt to persuade men to stop sticking their dicks in their wives and girlfriends. Your comment was really long so I’m not sure whether you’re asking me a question or just dispensing your thoughts at me. I’m glad you don’t force your wife to have intercourse with you. You totally deserve a cookie for that.

        It’s interesting to me that you think I’m “project[ing] the issues of a handful of [my] exes onto the entirety of [your] gender.” Perhaps this isn’t actually about me and my personal experiences. Perhaps this isn’t about you and your personal experiences either.

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  6. A perfect articulation of what I’ve thought privately for a long time. Thank you.

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  7. I always had that gnawing feeling of just having been assaulted and awoken from a spell after the times I’ve had PIV. I definitely haven’t processed it in the same way I’ve processed having been raped. I still don’t feel comfortable doing that and maybe I’ll make my own post why eventually. The truth though is that it is an act of violence. Consent as in most things, erases the violence of what happened.

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  8. (edited typo) As a bi atheist female, sex is shorthand for sexual intercourse, sex can lead to pregnancy and disease. Anal sex, the cousin of sex, can lead to disease. Mutual masturbation almost never leads to disease, mutual masturbation is fun and safe. I prefer to use the word sex for the dangerous stuff, and mutual masturbation and play for all other intimate contacts.

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  9. First off, let me just say how well this blog was written.

    When I initially read this blog, I disagreed with the majority of the points made. It didn’t fit with what I have experienced in my current relationship of fourteen years. I enjoy PiV and don’t feel like I’m “acquiescing” to PiV when, more often than not, I am the one who instigated it. I always orgasm, usually several times, and (in this relationship) rarely feel pain. I have a high sex drive and (now) enjoy PiV sex. That’s not rape. To say otherwise would be ludicrous and would be making a mockery of rape.

    Then I thought of my previous relationships…

    …and the points you raised in this blog fit them like a glove. Before my current partner, sex was boring and a highly painful chore that I gritted my teeth through. I never orgasmed and the sex was all about his pleasure – even when I was crying in pain. Sex was when he wanted it, how he wanted it. All the time. I never had a say.

    I think the points you raised also fit perfectly for the majority of young women today, thanks to online porn, which is exceptionally violent and advocates painful sex acts such as anal penetration (as one example). Misogyny is on the rise, alongside it are the numbers of young women who have been left traumatised and even requiring medical surgery because of brutal sex.

    So, having re-evaluated the points you raised, I do think you have hit the nail on the head and I thoroughly agree.

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    1. So I hope you’re not saying that you think you enjoy PIV, your just in a heterosexual relationship. So it naturally prevents you from seeing that PIV within the relationship is an act of violence and abuse. If you didn’t already know that.

      The fact that you talked about how great your piv sex is and now that you enjoy it in your current relationship and can’t feel pain, kind of contradicts the entire point of the feminist critique of piv, and that is that ALL piv is rape, and women are coerced, trained and groomed into having sexual responses and orgasms to it.

      I HOPE, that’s not what you’re saying, because you weren’t really clear about it.

      PIV criticism isn’t about an individual experience, but it definitely is a collective experience that all women face. And there is no right man, or partner, or nice guy that all women are supposed to meet later in life that will make them enjoy penetration and even experience orgasm from it.

      Anti-piv discourse is central to radical feminism, and the purpose of it is for women to get out of those heterosexual relationships, and try to avoid PIV, by separating from men.

      “Then I thought of my previous relationships…

      …and the points you raised in this blog fit them like a glove. Before my current partner, sex was boring and a highly painful chore that I gritted my teeth through. I never orgasmed and the sex was all about his pleasure – even when I was crying in pain. Sex was when he wanted it, how he wanted it. All the time. I never had a say.”

      I’m just warning you that your comment is confusing, and may trigger women who read it into thinking you are attempting to individualize PIV, and that women just need to find the right partner ( like you have?) so piv isn’t brutal, and therefore participate in heterosexuality ( competing for a man, body-hatred, self hatred, body mutilation, looking pretty, dieting, etc.).

      I HOPE that’s not what you are saying.

      “I think the points you raised also fit perfectly for the majority of young women today, thanks to online porn, which is exceptionally violent and advocates painful sex acts such as anal penetration (as one example). Misogyny is on the rise, alongside it are the numbers of young women who have been left tramautised and even requiring medical surgery because of brutal sex.”

      Well porn doesn’t show “painful sex acts”, this assumes sex isn’t pain by definition, I think porn shows painful acts that have been sexualized. Porn shows more brutal and violent piv, more ways to penetrate a woman, and other acts of violence such as hitting, beating, and choking combined with the violent act of sex itself.

      I don’t think misogyny is on the rise necessarily, i think it’s just intensified over the past century.Patriarchy has already risen, it’s already established itself as the dominating torture force, elevating men above everything.

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  10. This is SO GOOD. Thank you for writing it.

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  11. Oh, nice! It really helps to explain it in as many ways as possible. I like the illustrations / anecdotes you provide, especially with the sex education and foreplay and afterplay. I think every woman can relate to that. Those were one of my first realisations as a feminist, that “sex” was totally dick centered, and had nothing to do with me. It started and ended with his dick. No sex existed outside of his dick. And the fact it had nothing to do with me and my pleasure but only with his dick, this complete unilateralism of it, really makes it inherently assaultive.

    And sex education is really to teach us our status, function and role as dick receptacles, mixed with fake concern for our well-being with this reformist contraceptive bullshit, which makes it essentially a mindfuck. So what it does on the top of showing our function as receptacles as natural and innate and biological (especially because it’s often taught in biology classes) is feeding us with reformist lies that we’re equal to men because of contraception, that it’s something we can be in control of thanks to contraception. I always remember sex ed with disgust, feeling humiliated and ashamed of being a woman, with that pornographic display of our sex, a woman without a head, lying down and legs spread apart, not a subject but object of gaze. I remember feeling envious of men at the time, and finding having a penis so much better, because they weren’t dehumanised in that presentation.

    As you say, sex is only defined by the presence of a dick or a penetrative replacement /embodiment of it. No dick? no sex. Dick (even with a bicycle or exhaust pipe)? It’s sex. Sex, by definition, has to be a MAN putting his dick into SOMETHING, whether a woman, object or other living being. It is defined ONLY according to what men do with their dicks, and women don’t enter in that definition at all, a part as one of many possible receptacles. Which proves that men are the ones who have defined sex, from their perspective and their experience of it, which are different and antagonistic to our perspective and experience of penile penetration.

    Again, this is just like punching or any other form of violence, where what defines punching is just the puncher doing the punching. Unlike consent or contract, where, by definition, two parties are involved. Placing consent on women is a reversal, because the real contract and consent business is always only between two men, the one who purchases the woman and the one who sells this woman to him.

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  12. As a heterosexual white male who is attempting to decolonize my mind as well as erase years of conditioning by the dominant patriarchal culture of abuse; reading this makes me feel very sick and quite disturbed. My female partner who have been involved with for some time (who i truly love) has assured me that despite the stated perspective, that she will never stop enjoying “piv sex”… While of course i enjoy this type of sex, I now cannot help but feel overwhelming guilt. Is it impossible to be a true advocate of smashing patriarchy if I still engage in piv sex?? Props to the author for a thought provoking piece.

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    1. This isn’t about ‘smashing the patriarchy.’ Do you love your partner? If you do, why would you want your sex to put her at risk of death?

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      1. As i implied, I would give it up if she wanted. I never have seen my penis as a weapon….She identifies with radical feminism. After consideration I believe this anti piv sex stance de- humynizes the experience of womyn. Are there no womyn who can make a rational choice? People are affected by abuse and patriarchy in different ways. It is soley my partners choice and there are womyn who KNOW piv sex feels good to them and is worth the perceived risk. In closing men should be encouraged to take Neem leaf if they do not want children. Great choice for male contraception.

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      2. Please do not ever comment on my blog again.

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      3. Let’s engage in some math, shall we?

        I assume you’re talking United States in your little analysis right here, considering that radical feminism is extremely Amerocentric.

        Maternal death in the United States is 24 per 100 000. Mind that this lumps in pre-existent conditions with legitimate complications of birth, so the average number is lower. Though we will ignore this here.

        That would account for 0.024% complications.

        Condom effectiveness is approximately at 98%, obviously making it a 2% chance to become pregnant. We’re ignoring that you can just take a morning-after birth control if your condom breaks, but WHATEVER.

        Multiplying the percentages would give us… 0.000048 PERCENT.

        That’s the same chance as buying two Powerball tickets and winning the big money.

        And yet you treat maternal death as a reason to not have PIV sex ever.

        Did you quit your job yet? Just sitting there and buying lottery tickets, because obviously winning the grand prize is a likelyhood worth considering? It’s a disappearingly small chance, but the odds are the same, so it’s worth considering enough to dictate your daily life?

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      4. I stopped reading after “I assume you’re talking United States in your little analysis right here, considering that radical feminism is extremely Amerocentric.”

        I’m not from America and I don’t live in America.

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      5. “Please do not ever comment on my blog again.”

        What about his post upset you? I am very confused. Don’t you want a thriving marketplace of diverse ideas in which to prove unequivocally that yours is the best? Why would you discourage (what appeared to be) a genuinely interested reader from participating in a discussion about your article?

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      6. Again, I don’t write for men. I could not be less interested in anything men have to say about PIV. I hear it all day, every day. This blog is for women.

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  13. Very interesting post: I’ll need some time to process it.

    About sex education, this relates 100% to my experience. Taught by a woman teacher in an all girls school, but was all ‘penis goes up, penis goes in, wrigglers come out, baby gets started’. Where were we in that? Just the thing something goes into.

    We didn’t hear ONE WORD about the most sexual (as in orgasmic) organ in human biology: the clitoris, yet we all had them. That was in 1970 – I wonder if it’s different nowadays.

    Bizarrely, I only learnt I had a clitoris from some porn magazines a friend and I found in a hedge a couple of years later.

    A previous owner had burnt holes in all the nipples in all the photos…

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    1. No, they don’t teach us about the clitoris nowadays either. I was just a freshman in high school five years ago. I learnt about most my body via sites online that actually teach girls about themselves.

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  14. This is great analysis, but I would like to write a piece perhaps on the back of this one talking about the nature of “consent” in those “non-rape” scenarios and how a culture which holds women in collective hostage as a class is not one in which we can give *meaningful* consent. I am on the side of all PIV is rape. The word consent, while a distinguishing feature, is also a smoke mirror. It hides the fact that force can be more than just a man pinning a woman down. Cultural barriers, grooming, and threats to a woman’s survival are all around us covertly pushing us to say “yes” and let them fuck us. This makes the word consent only relevant to the ability of the woman to say no, and not just verbally, but emotionally as well. For example, a culture which offers little to no means to survive without a male breadwinner does not require a woman to say yes. She must say yes. And when she does say yes, she is “consenting” because to say no would threaten her life. That is where I believe that consent flies out the window and we find that men’s use of us as penis receptacles has an entire culture of patriarchy to summon and herd us like cattle into their beds. We may dissociate from the reason we cling to them for survival, calling it love, but an analysis of the structures in place within patriarchy reveals that no is not an option in the same way one can say no to eating an apple offered by their sister. Telling the master no is blasphemous, and there are consequences, sometimes overt and dire, sometimes covert and sinisterly dangerous while looking minor.

    But this is a great piece on its own. I’ll consider putting my own thoughts out there in a post later with the bits I just mentioned.

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  15. I have spent the last thirty odd years faking desire, orgasm and enjoyment. I have endured cystitis, bruising and burning sensations. I have had to resort to fake lubricant because my vagina doesn’t seem to be able to act the part the way I can. I have submitted to piv to placate violent or volatile or manipulative men. Or just to get some sleep. I have been celibate now for almost two years. Rejoice.

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  16. Informal Fallacy | Reply

    I feel like the idea that “since Rape and sex are both PIV then they both must be rape” is a deductive fallacy. While this argument, itself, could have true premises, I still feel it has a false conclusion. This augment is a fallacy because it does not take into account other possibilities.

    I am not saying that PIV cannot be rape, but there are other forms of intercourse that can be called rape.

    And I feel as if one major point about condoms is missing, that they are the only form of contraceptives that protect against STD’s in both partners. Sense when is pregnancy the worst thing in the world? I myself would rank AID’s and HIV far ahead of that.

    As for the orgasm argument, I believe most women who have had the real chance to really understand their bodies can achieve an orgasm. Sure, they need different means to achieve this then men, and maybe men are the ones who need to understand this? Most don’t — at least the ones I have encountered. But, it is possible to have an orgasm during PIV… but again, better sexual education on woman’s body’s is needed.

    In my opinion, I really feel like religion and old social norms, keeps woman back fom true sexual pleasure… not just men. It’s not just men who are still teaching the one sided views of sex. Woman need to education themselves and step out of the shadows of the past. But I digress.

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    1. “I feel like the idea that “since Rape and sex are both PIV then they both must be rape” is a deductive fallacy. While this argument, itself, could have true premises, I still feel it has a false conclusion. This augment is a fallacy because it does not take into account other possibilities.

      I am not saying that PIV cannot be rape, but there are other forms of intercourse that can be called rape.”

      You just ran in a full circle, trying to call PIV as rape a fallacy by saying other things can be rape too.

      PIV is the foundation of rape, the first rape, the original primitive form of rape. Then other forms of rape came after. So that’s why calling PIV rape is valid and not a fallacy because it’s violence that has become normalized. And as long as people think piv is okay, other forms of violence will carry out. It’s like a pattern.

      “And I feel as if one major point about condoms is missing, that they are the only form of contraceptives that protect against STD’s in both partners. Sense when is pregnancy the worst thing in the world? I myself would rank AID’s and HIV far ahead of that.”

      Condoms are bad for the environment, and only made possible through unsustainable and inherently destructive capitalism. Also they don’t make piv any less painful for the woman or complicated. Also the dudes don’t like them because they ruin the feel of the vaginal walls. ( Ewwww.)

      It’s not about ranking. It’s about “hey ALL THESE THINGS CAUSE A EXTREME AND LONGTERM SUFFERING,PAIN,AND DEATH FOR WOMEN!”, and they are all caused by PIV. So… uhhh… your point?

      Pregnancy is very dangerous. Most women would die from it if it wasn’t for modern day medicine and technology trying to maintain female bodily servitude as breeders for men. I know people who nearly bled to death and have had to be rushed to the ER after giving birth, and people who have developed diabetes from it!

      “As for the orgasm argument, I believe most women who have had the real chance to really understand their bodies can achieve an orgasm. Sure, they need different means to achieve this then men, and maybe men are the ones who need to understand this? Most don’t — at least the ones I have encountered. But, it is possible to have an orgasm during PIV… but again, better sexual education on woman’s body’s is needed.”

      Having an orgasm during PIV does not change the nature of what is happening during piv, or what piv actually is. read …. witchwind.wordpress.com

      “In my opinion, I really feel like religion and old social norms, keeps woman back fom true sexual pleasure… not just men. It’s not just men who are still teaching the one sided views of sex. Woman need to education themselves and step out of the shadows of the past. But I digress.”

      True, trying to create our own sexuality that is against male/rape-defined sexuality is important. It’s through sexuality where the way we relate to the world is expressed.

      But I don’t think having sexual pleasure or focusing on orgasms is going to liberate women at all or abolish the patriarchy and male oppression, in fact is will only benefit men.

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  17. […] where intercourse is seen as normal sexual interaction. Recently, AnnTagonist wrote the piece “Let Me Slip into Something a Little Less Comfortable” going into more detail about the nuance between consensual PIV and rape, explaining how the […]

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  18. I’m gonna need you to read this whole thing and read it well because this more than pisses me off and you need to stop spewing hateful bullshit before someone calls you on it for real.

    You may literally be the most ignorant human being in the entire species if this is a completely serious article. Part of me feels terrible for even seeing that you exist because quite frankly something fucked you up pretty bad and that’s probably what led up to you writing this glorified hate mail and this male shaming exclusionist bullshit. So lemme break this down for you as gently as possible:

    FUCK YOU

    Seriously. All you’re doing in this whole article is

    A) Shaming all men and generalizing the act of PIV sex simply because of your narrow and admittedly shitty experience with it

    B) Literally being the biggest hypochondriac over something that people have known for years, and

    C) Being the biggest hypocrite I didn’t even know could exist.

    Let’s start with the fact that PIV intercourse is HOW ALL MAMMALS FUCKING BREED YOU PHILISTINE, it’s literally encoded into the deepest recesses of our DNA for both heterosexual men AND women to seek it out. Penises were MADE to be put in things while vaginas were MADE to have things go in and out of them, sorry but that’s basic biology and if you can’t understand that then please seclude yourself from the rest of humanity for a while we don’t need hateful dumbasses who preach this shit.

    Let’s then acknowledge the fact that you casually throw around the word rape the way rednecks use racial slurs and hateful language. THAT IS NOT OK IN ANY WAY AT ALL. Rape is not to be taken lightly in EITHER direction. It’s a huge problem and when you associate even the most basic things with it it creates so much fear and hate within an activity that really brings people together and is the source of HUMAN LIFE YOU SELFISH ASSHOLE.

    Also, you are weaponizing penises. Let’s just take that in for a second. YOU ARE ACTUALLY TURNING THE CHARACTERISTIC INBORN SEXUAL ORGAN OF THE ENTIRETY OF MALEDOM INTO SOMETHING IT’S NOT. You’re worse than the ignoramuses who over sexualize breasts and make it so that girls have to be ashamed of their bodies because you are literally trying to make men feel horrible for being born with something that they can’t help and that they are told to hide and keep away from people unless there is serious consent anyways. I mean FUCK YOU you’re actually making sure to lessen peoples’ comfort levels and healthy ideas about sex just because your dumb ass couldn’t figure out how to do what humanity and all of the fucking animal kingdom has been up to since penises and vaginas were a THING.

    Next up, this is the part where I tell you that I am a biracial, gay, cisgendered male. So take what I say as you will, but let it be known that none of the above categories that I fit into detract from my argument when I say you are a cold, hateful, bitch. Most of my friends are straight males, and on the flip side most of my close friends are females, most of the intercourse I partake in is with men, and yet I have had PIV intercourse as well. I have been on the receiving end of a penis and on the giving end as well.

    AND NOW I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE EXAGGERATION YOU PUT FORTH IS LAUGHABLE AT BEST. Yeah, it can hurt to have someone else’s hard flesh inside you, hell it can even hurt to put it into someone. And yeah, there’s risk to having something like that in you back and forth for a while. YOU KNOW WHAT ELSE? THERE’S ACTUALLY HIGHER RISK OF INJURY WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEONE RAM YOU UP THE ASS SO DON’T EVEN TRY TO BE A MARTYR WITH ME HONEY. And let me tell you. I STILL DO IT AND HAVE IT DONE.

    And that isn’t because I’m satan, it isn’t because I just want a quick fuck or I need to bust a nut, and it isn’t because I see it as getting used or using someone for the benefit of some ejaculatory purpose. No. You know why I do it? Because it can be fun and beautiful and marvelous all in one. Yeah, sex has high risk with it, I’m sorry but that’s life, if you truly looked into the risk of any form of sexual gratification whether PIV or even masturbation, and then took to it the way you did the risk of PIV, you would sew your own vagina shut and never leave your home again. Trust me, especially in my case, I have a well above average penis in terms of size and length, and I understand the harm that that can do to someone who’s on the receiving end of it, and I take care to make sure I’m not harming my partner whether it be male or female. I also make sure there is consent and not just like “OMG I WANNA PLEASE DO IT WITH ME” no, they also want sex, it’s a two person action, and at least in most cases it involves two people being on the same fucking page about it, so I would like for you not to call it rape and call all men rapists because that’s not only a bitch move but is ignorant, over generalization, and quite frankly it’s stupid because you’re insulting half the fucking world in a way worse than any chauvinist dipshit I’ve ever met.

    Pain during sex or after sex or even BEFORE ACTUAL ENTRY is all kinds of natural. Now some pain should be looked at and helped. But the thing is all animals experience it in normal quantities, go look it the fuck up, and you can try to tell me that animals don’t know any better and that they are mostly based around patriarchal blah blah blah shut the fuck up educate yourself and see that even the animals with matriarchal society (such as the common Hyena where even the highest ranking male is below the lowest ranking female) HAVE PIV INTERCOURSE AS A MEANS OF MAKING SURE THE SPECIES IS NOT ONLY CONTINUED BUT CONTINUED WELL AND EVEN THEN THEIR SEX IS BASED ON ATTRACTION AND CONSENT. I’M NOT SAYING YOU SHOULD BE DENIED THE RIGHT TO AVOID PAIN, IF YOU DON’T WANT TO HAVE SEX BECAUSE YOU’RE TOO AFRAID OF A RISK THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE THE FUCKING FORTITUDE TO DEAL WITH THEN MAKE IT YOUR OWN BUSINESS AND DON’T GO AROUND HATING EVERY DUDE THAT WANTS TO HAVE SEX AND CALLING THEM RAPISTS HOLY SHIT.

    Oh and something else, MEN ARE PROGRAMMED TO PUT THEIR DICKS INTO THINGS BUT DONT GO USING THE OUTLIERS LIKE MEN WHO FUCK ANIMALS AND CARS AND SHIT AS AN EXAMPLE BECAUSE THAT’S LIKE ME USING NAZIS AS A WAY TO DESCRIBE ALL GERMANS EVER AND THATS JUST NOT CORRECT YOU DIPSHIT. And what else is normal is that Vaginas were literally made for the entry of a penis, they have a natural system of lubing themselves up when women get horny for a fucking reason, which is not to say women were made for men nor men for women, just in general, and biologically/heterosexually speaking THEY WERE MADE FOR EACHOTHER.

    OH BUT THERE’S MORE. You aren’t a feminist. You’re an awful human being. What you preach is not an equality of the sexes but rather a shaming of one to bring the other above it. That, my poor misguided fellow human, is the equivalent of the westboro baptist church using christianity to cover up the fact that they’re a bunch of blood sucking cunts who spew hate speech and do nothing but try to fuck everyone over with their dumbass doctrine. So you know what you can go join them and sit with the rest of th- OH WAIT NO YOU CANT BECAUSE AT LEAST THEY UNDERSTAND THE BASIC NORMALCY AND NECESSITY OF BREEDING DESPITE THE FACT THAT THEY PROBABLY SHOULDN’T BE.

    Then let’s culture you on straight men. Again, most of my friends fall under that category, and maybe it’s because I surround myself with good men, but you know what NONE OF THEM ARE FUCKING RAPISTS YOU BITCH HOLY DAMN. 99% of them aren’t out to just bust a quick nut with random women, and the ones that are don’t do everything and anything to do so, they just try to find women who would also like to get laid for a night and just have fun and move on I mean shit. I have a friend who was with a girl for 9 months and there was no form of penetration because he asked if she would ever see herself wanting to, she said no, and so he didn’t. THIS WAS A HORMONAL 17 YEAR OLD WHO HAD ONE OF THE STRONGEST SEX DRIVES I HAVE EVER SEEN AND HE HAD THE SELF CONTROL TO KEEP HIS DICK IN HIS PANTS FOR 9 MONTHS BECAUSE HE WAS OK WITH NOT FUCKING HER AND MASTURBATING ON HIS OWN. AND HE’S NOT THE ONLY GUY I KNOW TO DO THIS AND NOT RECEIVE SEX BY THE END OF IT SO YOU CAN SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT MEN BEING MINDLESS CREATURES WHO ONLY WANT SEX AND THAT SEX IS RAPE. (Oh I’m 20 btw and if you use that to try and discredit my argument then straight up you’re just an ageist bitch.)

    SEX CAN ALSO BE AN ACT OF LOVE AND CONNECTION AND QUITE FRANKLY IT CAN BE AND IS EXTREMELY HEALTHY FOR YOU BECAUSE IT IS NOT ONLY INTENSE EXERCISE BUT IT HELPS STAVE OFF ALL SORTS OF DISEASE AND MENTAL ILLNESS AS LONG AS YOU KEEP IT SAFE AND WRAP IT UP WHEN YOU NEED TO OR TAKE THE PILL OR SOMETHING. Personally I use a condom every time unless I’m with a partner I’m sure is STD/STI free or who I know for a fact is on some form of birth control BUT NEITHER I NOR MY FRIENDS WOULD EVER FORCE THAT ON SOMEONE SO WE MAKE SURE TO HAVE PROTECTION ON US AND MAKE SURE ALL IS WELL.

    AND NOW THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH THIS ARTICLE:

    YOU ARE TELLING WOMEN NOT TO EMBRACE THEIR OWN SEXUALITY, IN ESSENCE YOU ARE DOING EXACTLY WHAT THE WORST OF THE PATRIARCHY DOES TO WOMEN. YOU LITERALLY ARE DOING WHAT FEMINISM TELLS YOU NOT TO DO TO WOMEN AND YOU ARE A WOMEN AS FAR AS I CAN TELL. SO YOU KNOW WHAT GO THE FUCK BACK TO SCHOOL AND READ A BOOK AND FIND SOMEONE FUN AND INTERESTING AND GO HAVE SEX WITH THEM IN A WONDERFUL AND HEALTHY WAY SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND WHAT THE FUCK THE ENTIRE WORLD IS ON ABOUT WHEN THEY GO AND HAVE SEX WITH PEOPLE OR AT LEAST MAKE FRIENDS WHO CAN EXPLAIN IT TO YOU IF YOU REALLY ARE THAT MUCH AGAINST THE IDEA OF INTERCOURSE IN ANY PENETRATIVE FORM.

    EVERYONE IS ENTITLED TO THEIR SEXUAL DESIRES YES THAT MEANS EVEN MEN CAN WANT TO FUCK SOMETHING AND YOU KNOW WHAT AS LONG AS ALL PARTIES INVOLVED ARE HAPPY AND ON THE SAME PAGE AND WITHIN THE LAW THEN THEY CAN DO AS THEY PLEASE AND THAT’S NOT ONLY THEIR BUSINESS BUT PERFECTLY OK AND CERTAINLY NOT RAPE.

    Now I’m gonna lighten the blow of what I just threw at you with this.

    I agree that women should have better sex education that is geared towards them, I wholeheartedly support a sex ed class or just sex ed in general that tells women not only how to achieve more pleasure and orgasm but the safer and healthier ways for them to avoid pain or the risk of pregnancy and all that. Quite frankly women have been receiving the short end of sex for quite a while and I think that they need to be at least equal with men in bed, I also think that men need to be taught in a lot of cases that sex isn’t just plug and hump and that you have to explore and have more fun and try all kinds of play and whatnot and that it isn’t just about PIV. Male contraception should also be explained and more sought after and thought about as well because in general it can actually be a lot easier to use and hell sometimes it’s a lot safer too.

    But again, you’re a hateful piece of shit and I hope you understand that this fear mongering bullshit you’re spewing is nothing but cold bitchy words from someone who clearly doesn’t understand that males are needed in society just as much as women no matter what happens and that people should be not only comfortable with themselves but with other people because otherwise we’re all just gonna end up hating ourselves and others, you are a prime example of this in a concentrated form.

    So FUCK OFF and have a nice day <3

    P.S. I read the "things you should know before commenting" and the "things fans say" sections and from what I can deduce not only are those twitter comments perfectly correct but you're also just an immature waste of flesh with no understanding of how it works when you post stupid and harmful prattle on a medium where anyone can respond and read. so again FUCK YOU AND I CAN'T BELIEVE ANY OF THESE POOR MISGUIDED SOULS AGREE WITH YOU COMPLETELY WHAT THE SHIT.

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    1. Dude, you should get your own blog.

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    2. lol, the fact that you are so ENRAGED and pissed off is not only hilarious but shows that you feel men are entitled to PIV, and that a female talking about how it isn’t a reciprocating experience destroys the legitimacy of this entitlement.

      Infact, your anger is not only unreasonable, but just exposes your own misogyny and violent potential- and general stupidity.

      Also a penis is not made to go into things, or a vagina. That’s a myth. And vagina is definitely not made to have a penis rammed up inside of it because it was it wouldn’t cause bleeding, scrapes, pain, burning, and wouldn’t be a generally unpleasant and uncomfortable experience for women. Also, pleasure from it wouldn’t have to be coerced, trained, learned, and faked.

      The vagina is not a hole, but an organ. An organ that functions to let menstrual blood flow out, and to expand to become a birth canal. Yes it’s passage for sperm to travel up to the cervix, but that’s it, not a dick.

      Mammals rape, kill, and rape to death. Doesn’t make it right.

      And…

      “A) Shaming all men and generalizing the act of PIV sex simply because of your narrow and admittedly shitty experience with it

      B) Literally being the biggest hypochondriac over something that people have known for years, and

      C) Being the biggest hypocrite I didn’t even know could exist.”

      Nahh…. nope…nah. I think you’re the one generalizing the act of piv into this necessary, natural, inevitable, yet indefinabe act/experience, and screaming at us for challenging it.
      LOL, at your attempted gas-lighting with the painful misuse of the word hypochondriac ( for it is a rare word to be heard in a day).

      LMAO, at the biggest hypocrite part, as you scream, swear at an attack someone in your own (blogpost) comment.

      AND THE REST
      “….”

      TL;DR

      Also if you decide to reply, don’t expect me to read it, cuz i defs won’t. Unless you blocked which is even better.

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      1. Let’s get a few things put in the correct direction, you really just puked a bunch of groundless arguments, accusations, and assumptions at me in some attempt to justify your own bullshit.

        First of all, no one is saying men are entitled to PIV at all times, I said they are entitled to having a want for it and that WOMEN are entitled to wanting it was well. Oh and that it’s quite a bit necessary for the continuation of almost the entire animal kingdom and has been for quite a while but if you want some disgusting society where everyone has to resort to crude and costly birth methods that could otherwise be avoided then by all means do attempt to build it, I’ll be off with the rest of humanity doing what makes sense and staying in touch with reality.

        My anger is also perfectly reasonable, considering that she attacked a large portion of the entire world with unjustified slander, is spewing nothing but hatred, and even making it harder for women to get help especially when they’ve been raped or have legitimate feminist grievances. Articles like that one simply have no place gathering a following it’s horrid. That and anger is perfectly fine to feel so long as you have the self control not to act on it in harmful ways such as oh…I don’t know, getting trans people outed in both the workplace and schools, trying to write a letter to the UN simply to try and spread hate for a specific group of people or ooooooh maybe…hmmm…joining a disgustingly right winged group in an attempt to attack a teenager who was already so abused they were on suicide watch…Yeah…I guess I’m DEFINITELY the one with violent potential I’m just much too stupid to act on it because i have a penis…right? Ok (Gee I wonder if radical feminists are educated enough to read sarcasm…)

        And please, a MYTH? I sincerely hope you don’t plan on breeding because anything with the genes it took to get you that level of backwards and genuinely fucked up don’t deserve Darwin’s blessings I mean FUCK. There’s a reason that it takes a decently heavy amount of rubbing and surrounding stimulation for a penis to ejaculate, and a reason why vaginas seem to just simply fit around a penis and lube up enough for ease of entry and continuous motion. THERE’S ALSO A REASON A PENIS IS SHAPED LIKE A PEG WITH HUGE AMOUNTS OF NERVE ENDINGS AND WHY A VAGINA IS MADE LIKE A HOLE WITH NERVE ENDINGS AND SPECIALIZED FLESH IN CORRESPONDING PLACES. Hell even masturbation can cause everything sex can, the only thing it doesn’t cause is pregnancy and in most cases STD’s. But guess what that’s why we have condoms and testing and plan B when things like that are unwanted. And you know what gestation sure as hell should be wanted because without it nothing breathing would exist. And I’m not sure who you’ve been fucking but I personally know many women who confide in me well enough and believe me many of them (most of them) that have had sex very much enjoy it and don’t have to be coerced into it, learned in it, trained by someone, or forced to do it. I’m gonna need you to stop making women look weak, your movement seems to think that men need to be made weaker and women made stronger but women are already STRONG AS FUCK, what needs to change is how everybody (including you sick twats) views them and there needs to be value placed in that beautiful unique brand of strength.

        And what’s funny is that no matter how you look at it, the vagina is an organ in the shape of a hole with a bunch of flesh and muscle structures, whether you call it a canal, a tunnel, a “passage” or whatever else you want, that defines it as a type of hole. A hole is an absence of something surrounded by the immediate presence of another physical something. And no matter how you look at it, both a canal and a passage are both absences of space for the aid of transport of something by means of conveyance from one location to another that are surrounded by another kind of space. In simpler terms. Vagina = Hole. Penis = Conveyer. Thing Transported = Sperm. And like I said before, guess what marvelously seems to physically fit a hole better than anything else? A PEG. And what is a penis shaped like? A PEG. But guess Oh and what’s even better is that you seem to not understand where sperm comes from. IT COMES FROM DICKS. And you know what else? Unless you have some serious endurance problems you can’t just squirt sperm out of a penis out of nowhere, it takes work, it takes friction, it takes tension, it takes pleasure, and lots of well done stimulation that the vagina specializes in. And this isn’t me trying to glorify the pleasures of PIV, I’m gay, I could go the rest of my life without PIV and be more than fine. And even if I didn’t want to go without PIV, there is nothing wrong with having the desire for something so basic, instinctive and in fact NECESSARY to the reproduction of any sexual species. So if you’re saying that sperm is gonna go up someone’s vagina naturally and in a way that the entire world can actually afford and have access to, then it’s going up the old fashioned, tried and true, NON-FICTION-NON-MYTHOLOGICAL METHOD OF A GOOD FUCKING.

        And you know what, let’s talk about rape since you guys tend to get so fixated on it and have such a sick obsession with it and undermining what people who experience it go through. Rape isn’t ok. Rape is an awful act of going against the will of another by committing a sexual act without the consent of the other party(ies) involved. Rape is damaging, serious, and to be treated with delicacy, care, and severity all in one. And I will not allow you evil human beings to associate one of the most beautiful, connective, and healthy things that we as humans get to experience with something so terrible simply to further your cause of making the other half of the world look like shit for no reason. Your arguments on sex and Rape being the same all revolve around the point that because they both involve sex. But if you even bothered to take it a step further and think for a fucking second then you’d realize that there’s quite a number of incongruities. The most obvious being the idea of whole-hearted consent. And then we get to the idea that not all rape involves PIV. Oh wait, that’s right, it doesn’t just have to be a man who rapes a woman. Women rape men too if you hadn’t forgotten. But then you’d say “Oh but there’s still most likely PIV” well then let me make my point. Women can rape women, men can rape men, trans women can rape trans men, trans men can rape trans women, there doesn’t have to be either a penis or vagina involved if the mix and that by far kills your reliance on the PIV aspect to make sex and rape equate to each other. And like you said, animals can even do it too, congrats for figuring that out cupcake you really deserve a gold star on that one. But again, rape in the animal kingdom is such an outlier that you can’t use it to further your argument because they also aren’t usually cognizant enough to understand the concept of rape. But what can be said true and always true is that without PENIS GOING INTO A VAGINA AND RUBBING BACK AND FORTH INSIDE IT UNTIL THERE IS EJACULATION most if not all of the animal kingdom would either not exist or do so very shortly. Oh goddess maybe I should change my rhetoric and say “VAGINA EXCEPTING PENIS AND BEING PLEASURED BY DICK UNTIL THE DICK CAN GO NO FURTHER” thereby giving vocal power to one rather than the other which for some reason seems to be the only thing you guys can even read into even when it isn’t there.

        You know what though, you said it yourself, I am indeed toting sex as “this necessary, natural, inevitable, yet indefinable act/experience” but I’m not screaming at you for challenging it. Naw go ahead, think for yourself and think outside the box, then execute the actions necessary to live by the thought process on your own and in your own life, then try to fucking learn instead of stubbornly clinging to some shitty ideology that a hateful middle aged damaging immature bitch is sending your way through a screen. I mean shit this whole movement is probably a big old self hate complex that people took way too far. No you know what I’m screaming it you for? For taking something so basic and denying the most unequivocal truths about it and shaming people for having their opinions on it. If you simply had an opinion that would be one thing, but you go out of your way to insult people who have nothing to do with your deluded intentions and your main members within this movement try to target innocent people who have done nothing wrong. I mean where do you get the nerve to wave the banner of oppression and yet be the horrendous oppressors you are to these people? Hypocrisy at its finest you guys are worse than Pimps. That’s right, you guys are actually worse than people who sell women as cattle.

        Oh shit since people on this site like to wrongfully come down on my use of language and word choice let’s have an english lesson.

        hy·po·chon·dri·a
        ˌhīpəˈkändrēə
        noun
        1.
        abnormal anxiety about one’s health, esp. with an unwarranted fear that one has a serious disease or problem.

        hy·po·chon·dri·ac
        ˌhīpəˈkändrēˌak
        noun
        1.
        a person who is abnormally anxious about their health.
        synonyms: valetudinarian, neurotic

        Now let’s assess. Me calling her a hypochondriac is not only grammatically correct but perfectly in reason because she suffers from an abnormal anxiety about her own health especially with an unwarranted fear of sex and anything penile causing her death or disease.

        Well what do you know, the shoe fucking fits and it even fits you to the damn toe. And you just received an English lesson from a man whose first language was French <3 ISN'T BEING WORTHLESSLY IGNORANT THE BEST? (Oh did I forget to mention I speak Spanish AND sarcasm as well? You might have missed that with my last bit of it.)

        Oh and I'm not a hypocrite, I know and admit to the fact that I'm attacking you verbally, but I'm doing it with fact, by actually replying to and dissecting your argument, and by seeing things from multiple perspectives rather than stubbornly repeating the same shit that some you sick fucks attacked me and everyone even remotely like me with false accusations, disgusting hyperbole, defamatory language, oh and even offensive slurs specific to the demographic I fit into. So it only made sense for me to yell at you. Because what do you do when someone is uncontrollably stupid and then acts on it? You yell at them and hope that something gets through to their anuses which have been so ruthlessly stuffed with their own heads so that they not only shut the fuck up but never do something that stupid again. I know you guys are beyond the point of help, but you know what I can still try goddamnit.

        It's good to know that you won't be reading this, I mean at this point I've deduced that almost all of you inhale several cans of alphabet soup, shit it out all over some surface and have some random asshole type what's in that mess and post it here. Anyone dumb enough to agree to and follow this hateful bullshit can't hope to be literate let alone create valid arguments with any form of human language.

        Again, I hope the best for all of you and that you either get consensually laid in a wonderful way so you can shut your yaps about this tomfuckery, or just whatever it takes for you all to stop being ignorant exclusionist wastes of decidedly limited resources. And if that isn't possible please have fun getting all the way the fuck out of this plane of existence <3

        Have a good day

        With much Love <3 <3 <3

        -Regi-

        P.S.: I guess since you guys aren't "Pokémon Freaks" you wouldn't understand, but you'll be needing quite a few of these: http://static1.fjcdn.com/thumbnails/comments/That+ll+be+%C2%A5250+_cace14e312dda3d990c536ce8d5b5efc.jpeg

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      2. You’ve practically written a thesis here, Reg. Why you working at Panera?

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    3. Thank goodness there’s someone else with some sense here. I have never felt more trivialized or robbed of my agency than when reading this kind of argument. Radical feminists time and time again present themselves as the least respectful of women and the least tolerant of the choices of women who disagree with them.
      Please stop trying to make us into victims. How is that productive? There are enough women AND men in this world who are legitimately disadvantaged already. This is exactly why I no longer identify with feminism.

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      1. Where are all you Pokemon freaks coming from? It’s not 1998 any more.

        https://www.facebook.com/toots.shizzle?fref=ts

        mistycow72@gmail.com
        169.231.82.197

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    4. The dude doth protest too much, methinks.

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    5. Regi, you’re hilarious. If you start your own blog, I promise to read it regularly.

      While this article is well written, and indeed thought-provoking, it is far too extreme for my taste. I agree with the problems of sex education and with the blurriness and complexity of consent. I agree that women are wrongly taught to be passive by even the very language of sex (“the man puts his penis into the woman’s vagina).

      However, whereas I most certainly identify as a feminist, I do not take kindly to being told that I am a victim any time that I engage in PIV, that I am absolutely unable to give my consent under any circumstances, and that if I believe I enjoy sex then I must be brainwashed by the patriarchy. And I don’t take kindly to being told that I am not a proper feminist if I disagree with anything stated here, or if I like having sex with a man.

      To me, feminism is about being able to make one’s own choices and if I make the choice to have sex, yes, you may engage me a discussion about what that means culturally or historically (and you have!), but no, you may not shame me or the man of my choice. I will not allow you to scare me into thinking it’s going to kill me! It’s your body – if you don’t want to have PIV then don’t. But this is my body so if I want to then please don’t judge me. That’s not very sisterly.

      My intention here is to engage and discuss the issue that, clearly, we all find important despite our disagreements. Admittedly, people here seem to be very set in their options and not really open to discussion… so if you don’t want to discuss, fine, but my intention is certainly not to start or engage in an argument.

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      1. Hi. I never said in my blog that “you are a victim” or “if you enjoy sex you must be brainwashed by the patriarchy” and I didn’t say “you’re not a proper feminist if you disagree with anything stated here or if you like having sex with a man.” I have not attempted to shame you. All this is your reaction to the words I did write and it’s a pretty normal reaction.

        If you think your consent is completely freely given, why not try an ‘experiment’ of sorts? Tell your boyfriend you’re not going to let him have intercourse with you for the forseeable future. Sure you can have other forms of sexy times. You’ll get him off, he’ll get you off, but no intercourse. See how he reacts. See how long he stays with you. Watch him wheedle and plead. Then ask yourself again how free your consent is.

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  19. Alright so how are we supposed to reproduce as a species? This article is a horrifying example of why feminism is so poorly represented and misunderstood. I am a heterosexual female, I respect myself and my body, and I respect other women and women’s rights to have completely consensual sex (or not! literally do whatever you want because it is YOUR body!!). You’re calling all men rapists because they have an entirely NATURAL instinct to put their penis inside of a woman’s vagina? What if the two people in question are in love and agree that they want to have sex with each other? What if they want to start a family? Is that rape? You, my seriously misguided friend, have a lot of hate in your heart that you are reforming into unrealistic and terrible ideas about sexuality. I understand that countless women have fallen victim to senseless, hateful and violent sexual crimes. These crimes are deplorable and sickening. But to condemn women and men for having consensual sex with one another? Ignorance at its finest.

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    1. pretty sure human reproduction is quite possible without PIV

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      1. You mean costly, unnatural human reproduction meant for people who cannot, through PIV, achieve fertilization? Sure! But I’m also pretty sure that without NATURAL PIV most of the human population would not exist.

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      2. Or the fact that sperm can travel from the vulva all the way to the uterus. That’s natural and not costly at all, nor is intercourse needed. Just saying.

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      3. Can and will are two very different words. Indeed, sperm CAN travel from the vulva all the way to the uterus, it also CAN die and be unable to fertilize an egg even when directly put up there. But quiteSome people do not have healthy enough sperm or vaginas for that to be a thing, and even if both are perfectly healthy it may not survive all the way there, sperm are not some crazy impressive super strong warriors that can just fly their way into where they need to be. Why do you think longer penises even get hard enough to be inserted into something or extend? Because it increases the chance of fertilization and ensures pregnancy or at least gets close to it, hell even when it’s inside it shoots sperm forth pretty damn fast and in large loads (when healthy) to add some extra insurance. If we didn’t need for penises and vaginas to function this way they wouldn’t have evolved that way in BILLIONS UPON BILLIONS OF ORGANISMS. It’s not just point and shoot, sex is not some cheap 1988 arcade game that works on 25 cents (unlike the author of this blog). I mean really try to have non penetrative sex all you want that’s fine no one is gonna hate you for it, just don’t drag everyone down to hell with you when you can’t further your own genetic line and your way of thought dies out (for which we can only hope.)
        <3

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      4. So people who don’t attempt to reproduce are letting their genetic lines and thoughts die out? If my sibling has children, they will share some of my genetic traits. My thoughts will be carried on via other younger radfems (even though I’m only eighteen and ideally have a long time to get my thoughts out). But thank you for wishing that I never reproduce or write a book or something. That’s so sweet of you, really.

        But surely you aren’t hoping for conception every time you engage in intercourse. Most people aren’t. And since that is what piv is so obviously meant for, *reproduction*, then why engage in it so often? There are other ways to be intimate and bond, and they are not as risky or potentially life-changing.

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      5. But aren’t you gay? What the hell do you care about what goes into vaginas?

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  20. […] Here are the two blogs to which I am referring: Radical Wind and Ann Tagonist […]

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  21. Reg, how is a penis shaped ? I am not quite clear on that. I am glad that there are men like you who give the nod to what are legitimate feminist grievances. Also…more words, please.

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  22. Oh, and, reg ? An ovum is not a passive thing that ” is fertilized “. I realize that you know everything about how the female body works and all…but, you might want to brush up a bit.

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  23. guywhotalks_sometimes | Reply

    Why, as a man, is the only thing I can do with a woman rape?

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    1. This man thinks the only thing he can do with a woman is put his penis inside her. This is what men think. Wake up, women.

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  24. This response is actually based on one of your responses to a comment in which you said “Do you love your partner? If you do, why would you want your sex to put her at risk of death?”

    In framing pregnancy as being inherently risky, deadly and undesirable, how do you explain lesbian couples who are looking to become mothers – and not through adoption? Obviously they will not be doing this through PIV, but do you still object to a woman choosing pregnancy outright given the risks that you outlined? Would you then define this act as self-hating violence given that you define pregancy itself as an inherently violent act that ought to be avoided? In-vitro fertilization still poses all of the risks of pregnancy you discussed with the only differentiating factor being the absence of the violent act of PIV fertilization.

    I am just confused by the way you have criminalized pregnancy and motherhood. Sure, in the context of heterosexual relationships it could be seen as a risk imposed upon a woman through the weaponization of the phallus but how do you then explain radfem lesbians or non-het women who still seek to experience childbirth through scientific means? More receptacle grooming?

    I don’t mean to sound facetious about it, I just want to know your thoughts on this: If all women were to avoid pregnancy because of the inherent risks, how WOULD procreation continue? You are completely right in that women are NOT receptacles and it isn’t the responsibility of women to continue our species simply for the sake of it, but I mean what if a woman in her own right as an individual, and not because of a man, wanted to experience motherhood on her own (whether by herself or with a non-male partner)?

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    1. To your first question: Lesbians are women and don’t live in a magical bubble of lesbianism that’s free from patriarchal influence.

      To your second question: I’m not really concerned with how procreation would continue. There will never be a time when all women decide to shun pregnancy so it’s not worth worrying about.

      To your third question: I would wish her health and happiness.

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  25. “Pain is your body’s way of telling you something is wrong”

    You use this statement to try to argue that, because PIV is sometimes painful, it is wrong for your body to experience it.

    1. Pain is your body’s way of telling you something is wrong
    2. PIV can be painful
    Conclusion: PIV is wrong

    However, there are plenty of normal, natural reactions that occur in the human body that are also sometimes painful.

    1. Pain is your body’s way of telling you something is wrong
    2. Giving birth is always painful
    Conclusion: Giving birth is wrong

    Are you suggesting that, if we are in a truly moral society, that this generation right here should be the last generation to ever live? Because childbirth is painful, and pain is wrong, so no one should have children? Would you also suggest that any medical procedure that involves pain should be outlawed? Even when these procedures clearly help people? Or the countless other examples of helpful pain I could come up with?

    Never mind the fact that sex is not painful for every woman. Never mind the fact that the vast, vast majority of women love sex. Those are minor criticisms. This is the one you simply cannot escape.

    You can get around suggesting that PIV is wrong. There are some loopholes. There is no loophole for birth. There will be pain. I’m sure you believe that bearing children is somehow another symptom of male oppression (as if men forced this biological fact onto you), but you would not be here if someone had not given birth to you. No one would be here. Life would cease to exist. If you truly believe that, because of our fucking biology, that we cannot be a moral species, then I can’t really say anything else to you. Maybe you should just start blaming God. Christianity says he’s a man, and if you start believing in him at least you would have some basis for blaming a man for your biology.

    I don’t know why I wrote any of this, to be honest. I guess I was just surprised that you actually accept some public criticisms. Despite your obvious mental illness*, I really appreciate the fact that you will at least listen to dissenting opinion. Or pretend to listen. That’s rare. So thanks.

    *I mean this sincerely. I hope you can get over whatever serious trauma you have obviously endured and can get some real help. Even if you can never enjoy a normal, healthy sex life ever again, you at least deserve to know what it’s like to not be filled with absolute hatred for half of the population.

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    1. As a lesbian, I can pretty much 100% guarantee my sex life is better than yours but I’m touched by your concern. I’m sorry you think getting dicked down is the only way you can enjoy a “normal, healthy sex life.”

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      1. As a lesbian, what are your thoughts on fisting? You see where I’m going with this…?

        It’s a largely lesbian activity, and while you can certainly make the argument that even lesbians are affected by patriarchal norms, it’s a bit of a stretch (pun DEFINITELY intended) to imagine that two homosexual women in a locked room would willingly submit to having something much larger than a penis inserted into their vaginas strictly to conform to male ideals. Not only that, but fists are more demonstrably weapons than dicks. I don’t even feel like I have to explain that one. Fisting puts you at a higher risk of injury than PIV intercourse. Why would you do that to someone you claim to love? Maybe you can’t speak from personal experience, I don’t want to make assumptions, but perhaps you can answer this question through the lens you used to analyze PIV? Is fisting necessarily a form of violence? Or is it more nuanced than that?

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      2. Why on earth do you think I would want to talk to a strange man on the internet about this? My analysis of PIV stems from the inherent power disparity between men and women. That power disparity doesn’t exist between two women.

        “Fists are more demonstrably weapons than dicks.” – I don’t even know what to say about this. For one thing, I have never met a lesbian who punches her girlfriend in the vagina. For another, I’m sure it’s pretty much impossible to get someone pregnant or give them an STI by touching them with your hand.

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  26. I hope all of you get actually raped. A real violent one that you will never confuse for PIV. Everytime you worthless old hags that no one would ever fuck, dare to compare loving intercourse between adults to rape, you rob every person whose actually experienced REAL rape their chance of legitimacy. I know I won’t change any of your brain washed minds. Just know you should be ashamed of yourselfs. It’s always hilarious when disgusting fat bay Duke looking feminist are always the most worried about “rape” too. As of any one would ever fuck you vile bitches. I can only hope there is someone out there deranged enough to violently beat the fuck out of you and then violate you with his “Weaponized” penus.

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    1. I’m just going to leave this here with a note of your email & IP addresses and a link to your Facebook page.

      jessemfguire@yahoo.com
      99.60.100.8
      https://www.facebook.com/deletionofyourself/about

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      1. Heyhey. I wholeheartedly don’t agree with what john just said above, but posting his personal information without his consent is a violation of Information Privacy, Artical 12 of the Human Rights Act (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Declaration_of_Human_Rights) and is illegal, as well as the subsequent invasion of his privacy.

        Please remove that comment, or it may well get your site shut down, if not worse.

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      2. If you make your information publicly available on the internet, it is no longer private.

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      3. True, but that’s not what he did. You have taken information that was not publicly available (his email, for example), and used it to invade his privacy by contacting people he knows without permission.

        That is not ok, because a stranger could theoretically identify john from the information you have posted in the public domain they wouldn’t have had access to, like email and facebook.

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      4. Oh well. Sue me.

        I’ve also sent screenshots of what John (real name Jesse McGuire) said to all his facebook friends. What a bad bitch I am.

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      5. @Alex,

        You have taken information that was not publicly available (his email, for example), and used it to invade his privacy by contacting people he knows without permission.

        Dude, you read the guy’s comment. He threatened her. That’s also covered in the Declaration (Article 3, security of person), but even so I am not sure that document is meant to govern the actions of individuals. It looks like it is saying individuals have these rights, and their governments cannot violate them. (In theory, anyway … I can think of a lot of ways the American government falls short of respecting these rights in all its people!)

        TL;DR: Ann is not the aggressor. “John” is the aggressor, and Ann has defended herself.

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    2. And just so you know, I’ve forwarded a screenshot of this comment, complete with your email address and IP, to a bunch of hot girls on your facebook friends list. Good luck convincing them to let you stick your dick in them!

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      1. Nice. I hope you sent it to his mother, so she can see what a penus (sic) she raised.

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  27. Hi. Sorry for slight necro, but I just stumbled upon this and thought that it’s not too old to ask some questions.
    First of all, thanks for the article — and for the blog in general. Your arguments are usually so solid, they are petrifying :).
    You raise fair points about unfortunate implications of implied vaginal penetration in every heterosexual relationship. This is indeed harmful, seeing how imperfect, unpleasant, and dangerous (especially for women) this practice is.
    I disagree with you that any pleasure a woman can get from penetrational sex is from eroticizing subordination. After all, vaginal orgasms, though not universal, are not so rare, and some might find genuine pleasure in this act. But this cannot really be discussed rationally, as it’s the matter of opinions.
    I, however, raise an eyebrow to your supposed tries to shame those women who claim to enjoy inserting penises into their vaginas. I mean, you drew the good parallel: like BDSM, if precautions are taken, it’s all the matter of personal choice and mutual consent.
    It also begs a question. Of course, sex is absolutely not about childbirth. Modern culture has pretty good understanding of this. But what about actual childbirth? It seems that various animals achieve fertilization through penetration, up to, for example, anglerfish, for whom it’s also much more weird. Do you think that this is wrong and we should transcend it by whatever means? Or do you just believe in extreme caution during fertilization?
    P.S.: What’s wrong with Pokemon?

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    1. I don’t think we should be reproducing any more. There are enough people on this planet already. It’s full.

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      1. They’ll eventually die off, y’know.

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      2. That’s not really something I’m concerned about.

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  28. Hi.
    First of all I’d like to say that I found your post interesting but oddly offensive towards women. I am a woman in a relationship with a man and have consensual sex, albeit not very often. I have been with him for over a year. Sometimes we can go months and months without having penetrative sex because I simply don’t feel like it.
    In my previous relationship which lasted 4 years we spent 1/2 of those years not having penetrative sex for the same reasons. No whinning, no begging just complete and utter understanding on both their parts.
    I find your article almost the polar opposite of empowering. As a woman, I act, think and do whatever the fuck I want. If I want to have penetrative sex then I will. If I don’t want to for several years then I simply won’t.
    You have to let people make their own decisions, just as you, as a gay woman wouldn’t want someone to try and ‘shout the gay’ out of you, don’t try and ‘shout the piv sex’ out of people either because it doesn’t work and it’s divisive.

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    1. I’m unsure how me typing words on the internet is stopping anyone from making their own decisions. People on the internet shout about how shitty lesbians are all the time. That doesn’t stop me from actually living my life or choosing my choices.

      You seem happy with your life and that’s great. I’m happy you’re happy. The point of this article is to perhaps ignite a spark in women who are not happy. If you like your life then go and live it. Have fun. But don’t tell me I shouldn’t articulate my thoughts to other women who may be thinking the same way. It’s ok to think this way. Women saying “no thanks” to any form of sexual activity harms no one. Women telling other women they’re allowed to say no is harming no one.

      P.S. I really don’t care about your sex life and it’s extremely disrespectful of you to tell me about it without being invited to.

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      1. Thanks for your reply. I think the problem is more to do with people/women who are quite impressionable. Some of the things you have said on here could really frighten a lot of women or young women who aren’t confident or comfortable enough to decide for themselves.
        The words of people on the internet does have an affect on people – take pro anorexia websites for instance.
        I absolutely agree that it’s a womans choice whether she wants to participate in anything at all and it’s okay not to want to do that either, and I agree that women telling other women they are allowed to say no is absolutely fine too. What I don’t believe is okay is to specifically say to women that they shouldn’t engage in whatever sexual activity they wish to. I don’t feel that you are saying this in the original post really but I do feel you are saying this to people who have commented who do engage in that particular sexual activity.

        I apologise if telling you about my sex life was disrespectful but I felt that it was relevant since you told another woman that men will not stand for it if you don’t have penetrative sex with them whilst in a relationship.

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      2. Do you think what I’ve written here might frighten young women into not having intercourse with men? If so, do you think that’s a terrible thing? My intent is not to frighten anyone. I can only speak the truth as I see it. Sometimes the truth is really frightening. Like, right now as I’m typing this, a woman is being raped by a man somewhere. That’s frightening. Women all over the world are being denied life saving health care. That’s frightening.

        I’m not telling women to do anything they don’t want to do. I’m saying, “Hey, have you considered this? What happens if you look at this thing from a different angle?” You’re free to make your own conclusions. If you think I’m totally wrong, then you can go ahead and live your life and choose your choices. I don’t have the power to stop anyone from doing that. I just wanted to put an idea out there.

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  29. What about lesbian fingers-in-vagina-sex? Is that also rape? I’m not much into penetration myself but if a woman I’m with likes it (and I know many who do) I’m all for it and enjoy finger-fucking women. Would you also consider this a form of rape? What about strap-on dildos?

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    1. This post is about heterosexual intercourse. It doesn’t say “vaginal penetration is rape”.

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      1. No but now you’re just dodging my question. Why is it okay if something (fingers, strap-on,…) is put into a vagina in non-heterosexual context, but when it’s heterosexual it can only be rape and nothing else? This makes no sense whatsoever. I agree that vaginas shouldn’t be reduced to “made for things to be put in” but clearly there are women who enjoy penetration, whether it’s fingers, a strap-on dildo, or a penis. If it’s okay for me to fuck a woman with a strap-on, why wouldn’t it be okay to substitute the strap-on with a penis? I see no logic there, only absurd ideology.

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      2. I would encourage you to read the post again because I’ve already answered your question and I don’t have time for this.

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      3. Erm… no, you haven’t. I have read the post and it doesn’t mention lesbians, except in the line where you talk about all women being expected to have penises put into their vagina. I think you’re just avoiding answering my question because the whole “PIV is always rape” idea really doesn’t hold up to logical reasoning.

        Like I said, I agree that neither should vaginas be reduced to “made to put things in” nor should penises be considered “made to put into things”. But of course you *can* put things into a vagina and you also *can* put a penis into things, so why is it that some combinations are okay whereas “penis in vagina” is rape, always.

        Penis in other man’s ass? Fine.
        Fingers or strap-on in woman’s vagina? Fine.
        Penis in vagina? Rape!!!

        No. Sense. Whatsoever.

        It’s not that you “don’t have time for this”, but you have no reasonable counter-argument because there isn’t one. But I’m pretty sure that trying to argue with you it pointless, so I’m going to leave it at that.

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      4. Exactly. It doesn’t mention lesbians because it’s not about lesbians. It’s about heterosexual intercourse. If I wanted to write a blog post about lesbians, I would have done that. Women are not conditioned to put other women’s fingers inside them. We are conditioned to accept dick.

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      5. But criticizing the central position of PIV in the way sex is taught and talked about is not the same as saying PIV = rape. There are many things in your post that I agree with but, again, drawing the conclusion that PIV is always, and can always ever be rape is ridiculous.

        Imagine a world in which children are taught about their bodies and sex in an open, empowering way. Where they are given information that covers everything from masturbation to all kinds of other possible ways to have great sex (or no sex at all, if they prefer that), where PIV is only one among many, many ways to have sex and in no way mandatory. Would you still consider PIV rape in this context?

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      6. Why do you want me to imagine a world? We don’t live in a word like that. If I wanted to write about imaginary stuff, I’d write fiction. I do reality here.

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  30. Very thought-provoking article. Well done.

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  31. I’m a little bit confused. You specifically say sex ” means a man inserting his penis into a woman’s vagina until he ejaculates. After the man ejaculates, the sex is finished.” Okay… but I’m gay. So, by your definition, what me and my partner do… is not defined as sex.

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    1. If you read more carefully, you would see that it’s not my definition of sex. That’s how our culture defines sex.

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  32. Hello,

    I had found your article through tumblr and read it yesterday.
    Although I do not wholeheartedly agree with your views (at least not now, 24 hours after reading it) your text got me thinking. It got me thinking hard and for many hours.

    As I was lying in my bed I got the idea that I’d like more people to be exposed to your written piece, regardless of what my opinion was.

    It beatifully coincides with me trying to find ways to improve in my field – translation.
    And so the idea of starting a blog where I translate English texts that moved me was born.

    Would you agree to having your text be the first translated article on my blog?

    I will of course agree if you decline.

    Best regards,

    N.

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    1. Thank you! Yes, you can translate it if you’d like to. Could you send me a link once you’ve done it and I’ll put it on here?

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      1. Thank you, that’s very much appreciated. I will do that, sure.

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